Suggested Change to the PPD System

[7im]

Mental exercise...

Assuming 1 point equals 1 WU when the project started in 2000, and the processing power doubles every 18 months, we go from 1 point to 256 points in 12 years. Then add in 3x speed up when SSE was added 2003ish. 2x speedup with Intel and AMD doubled the SSE bit-width on core 2 chip technology few years later. We end up at 1536 PPD, just assuming Moores law, and 2 basic chip improvements.

Big WU bonus (2x for SMP, a project based bonus) = 3072 PPD.

4 cores? 12,288 PPD
8 cores? 24,576 PPD
64 cores? 196,608 PPD
128 cores? 393,216 PPD

See, we really aren't that far off the PPD we should be getting just with natural technilogical advance. Ya, sure, I picked convenient numbers, and they fit nicely, they also have the benefit of being accurate.

Anyone see a problem with PPD going forward?

I for one don't.

Look harder...

[bruce]

Why dont we just scrap points completely and move to workunits completed as the main currency.

Simple answer: because a majority of donors think the points system is better than the workunit-completed method. The official stats already provide data in BOTH currencies and you can choose to use either one without anybody knowing or caring but you.

Simple answer #2. Probably because with the same hardware, one WU may take a day and the next WU can take 5 days but after 5 days, you will have earned about the same number of points and perhaps 5 times as many WUs.

[vbironchef]

7im, I was agreeing with you. What did I miss? What do you think about points or WU's in exchange for cash donations. With my rigs just a couple of years old, I can't justify upgrading parts for more points. It would be a lot easier to send let's say 20 dollars a month instead of a extra 50 a month to the electric company. Not to mention the extra money to upgrade computers just to stay competitive in the current point system. Just a thought. I'm sure their would be a interest in a cash donation rather having to explain to your wife why you need a faster computer. Right now I have a 980X, I7 860, and a Intel QX6700. 2 evga 570's and a gtx 285 graphic card. I hope you see my issue. The Intel QX6700 and the gtx 285 are not worth running 24/7 due to the reduced points. In fact, my 2 570's are not woth running 24/7 because of the extra fan noise that started about a month ago due to greater power requirments made by F@H. That leaves me with running 2 smp WU's that really can't even come close to the newer computers that are very O.C. So I hope you see my dilemma. I support F@H and I hope everyone can see my point of view.

[v00d00]

Why dont we just scrap points completely and move to workunits completed as the main currency.

Simple answer: because a majority of donors think the points system is better than the workunit-completed method. The official stats already provide data in BOTH currencies and you can choose to use either one without anybody knowing or caring but you.

Simple answer #2. Probably because with the same hardware, one WU may take a day and the next WU can take 5 days but after 5 days, you will have earned about the same number of points and perhaps 5 times as many WUs.

Yeah i know it will never happen, but since everyone is bitching about it, i may as well have my say (for the fourth or fifth time over the last 7 years).

These threads have a habit of coming back on almost a yearly cycle. The last time was when Big WU first got released and loads of people complained, and before that was it PS3's or SMP on dual cores vs UniProc.

One thing that never changes is people start these pointless threads every year, and how much good do they do? I guess it gives people a forum to vent on inadequacies.

I shall make a note to post something similar in next years PPD thread, when probably GPU gets as much points as BigAdv and they are whining about how the points system is unfair.

Until then, happy folding.

[bruce]

I support F@H and I hope everyone can see my point of view.

It's election season in the USA. I hear a lot more politicians saying that right now that I ususally do (with something else substituted for F@H). Unfortunately there's a pretty good chance that almost half of the people will see their point of view and almost half will not -- which is why these annual discussions go on and on and on....

[vbironchef]

To bruce : Are you saying F@H doesn't want my cash (donation)? Just because I stopped F@H, does not mean I don't still support the project and cause!

[Jesse_V]

To bruce : Are you saying F@H doesn't want my cash (donation)? Just because I stopped F@H, does not mean I don't still support the project and cause!

This link is still alive: http://folding.stanford.edu/English/Donate

[vbironchef]

I am waiting for bruce to respond since he threatened to ban me from this website. I already knew about the ability to give a donation to F@H. Still no response to cash for points. I think it's a good suggestion.

[Jesse_V]

I am waiting for bruce to respond since he threatened to ban me from this website. I already knew about the ability to give a donation to F@H. Still no response to cash for points. I think it's a good suggestion.

I disagree. Look at how many folders there are. Where would all that money come from? Grants/donations are expected to go to scientific studies, etc, not pay to users for volunteering our systems. AFAIK, no other DC project does that. To me, points are enough but its important to have a fair system. There's already a lot of squabbling over not getting enough made-up points, I don't even want to see what happens if we're talking about real money! So it's an interesting suggestion, but IMHO is less practical than K1wi's point adjustment system.

[vbironchef]

I am suggesting doing both. Never said anything about not folding. What's the big deal assigning points for a cash donation? Remember points don't cost anthing or really mater. Just keeps folding fun and competitive.

[Grandpa_01]

I am waiting for bruce to respond since he threatened to ban me from this website. I already knew about the ability to give a donation to F@H. Still no response to cash for points. I think it's a good suggestion.

Just a guess but I would say that bruce threatened to ban you because of your post on this forum. I just went back and read your post since the day you joined most have been sarcastic a few potshots at other members. With a name like vbironchef it makes it appear that you are a spammer and just going for post count.

If I were a mod I most likely would be watching you myself.

[vbironchef]

I am waiting for bruce to respond since he threatened to ban me from this website. I already knew about the ability to give a donation to F@H. Still no response to cash for points. I think it's a good suggestion.

Just a guess but I would say that bruce threatened to ban you because of your post on this forum. I just went back and read your post since the day you joined most have been sarcastic a few potshots at other members. With a name like vbironchef it makes it appear that you are a spammer and just going for post count.

If I were a mod I most likely would be watching you myself.

I have been folding for 5 years, just look at my sig. As far as my username goes, my wife is a visual basic programmer and I am a certified chef. As far as post count goes I could care less. I do agree I have been a little to harsh on some people and I apologize if some people got offended. Now that's out of the way, and just look at how many posts I have on LegitReviews. I am not a spammer. Let's get back to topic. My first name is Victor and my wifes first name is Natasha. victor/natasha. Do you understand now? By the way, I hate spammers! and Facebook!

Just would like to point out that Legit Reviews, team 38296 is down to 11 active folders and 303 inactive folders. Something is wrong with this picture.

[Leonardo]

team 38296 is down to 11 active folders and 303 inactive folders. Something is wrong with this picture.

Indeed, your team fell apart just as mine did a couple years back. The members of my team became more interested in gaming, parties, and social fluff. I can't speak for your team.

While our teams have foundered, others have flourished.

Such is the case with nearly any human endeavor.

[mdk777]

meh...

In this age it is hard to hold someone's attention when you are standing in front of them talking directly to them....must answer this text...you don't mind do you?....

Holding attention and maintaining participation in a long...5,10, 25 year project...now that is really asking a great deal.

points, how ever they are configured will not keep people participating for the long haul. Only an appreciation of the end goals and updates on the process will keep that long term interest.

[7im]

I was looking at the top 50 producers, out of curiosity, maybe to find some new perspective on PPD. Maybe not new to me, but the contrast is at least interesting...

Code: Select all

Rank     Name                 Total Points    Total WUs
 32       tear                   291761401         815   
 
 36       SimlockRemoteServer    288572622      818846